Found your blog through my dad a few months back, and it’s the first one I check every morning. I have seen you post some stuff about your opposition to the permanent loss of 2nd Amendment rights for felons. I am one of those felons. In 1998, I was making some really poor decisions and doing a lot of dumb things, which eventually ended up getting me convicted for distribution of a controlled substance. I served a little time in prison and got out later that year. Since then, I have been a volunteer firefighter, got married, have an awesome job, and have NEVER been in trouble. I am a hard-right conservative, and am a firm believer in personal responsibility. I knew what I was doing back then was illegal, and I knew the consequences. So I can’t blame anybody but myself, but I really, really want to own guns again. My dad is a gun nut, my wife is a CCW holder, and I want to be able to enjoy my right to shoot with them.
Soooo… The reason I am e-mailing you is that I am wondering if you might have any suggestions on how and where to start the process for restoring those rights. I have asked around a bit on some local forums, and talked to several LEO friends, but they all said that the restoration process goes through the ATF and that the Clintons supposedly cut funding for that particular program and now if you send an application for restoration, you get a letter saying that there is currently no funding to process said application. I’m wondering if you might have suggestions or ideas on where to look further on this. Or perhaps you would pose that question to your faithful readers? I thought about going to the NRA, but I would think they’d be disinclined to assist me, just because we all know how the liberals would portray something like that. “NRA Fights to GIVE Guns to Criminals!”…
First off, remember Robb's story about the guy who got into hot water because he had a conviction as a teen and his wife some many years later owned guns. Don't be too open about what may or may not reside with you if you're not 100% certain it's copacetive with local law enforcement.
Secondly, thanks for the kind words.
Thirdly, find your local state gun enthusiast affiliation (like GOAL here in MA). More than likely they maintain a list of lawyers who specialize in Second Amendment issues. Chances are a brief consultation with someone who specializes in having rights restored will let you know if it's possible or not. Where it's a drug charge, there may be some federal issues involved - I honestly don't know - so legal representation may be needed.
Lastly, don't necessarily write off the NRA. They might not work publicly to get a felon's rights restored, but they may be able to point you in the right direction. If nothing else they're an incredible resource for information on what's local to you and what the state and federal rules are that apply to your situation.
Best of luck in your quest. Your story is EXACTLY why I think that gun rights should be restored upon serving one's time. A youthful mistake (and let's face it, if we didn't have this ridiculous "War on Drugs" it never would have happened) will haunt you your entire life, and preclude you from using the best tools available to protect yourself and your loved ones. At the very least there should be a time limit - if you stay clean for X years after finishing your parole, you get full restoration.
In any case, hopefully someone can shed some light on the process and perhaps get you started on your path to gunnie redemption.
That is all.
24 comments:
Wow....
Well, I'm torn here. The law is the law, and the reader/poster/felon does score points by understanding that he did some really stupid things that are now haunting him, and he's manning up to them.
If nothing else, it shows a commitment to the law, and an acceptance of past misdeeds.
Now...as far as restoration is concerned, that is best handled on a case-by-case basis, which the USA does now, to some degree. A small degree yes, but nonetheless the ability is there.
Should it be easy? Absolutely NOT. There must be a commitment demonstrated to win back the trust of the people.
Jay has given good advice...seek the help of an attorney, one well-versed in 2nd Amendment rights. Start with the NRA...they have a stable of competent attorneys that they can refer you to, and you can begin the process of restoring your rights.
That being said..do I believe that once you've done your time, you should have full restoration upon completion? Nope, not by a long shot. You are born in this country with certain unalienable rights, amongst those rights are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Once you break the law, that trust placed in you by your fellow citizens has been broken, and can almost never be restored. It should be a long and arduous process, and in my opinion should carry penalties so severe if something happens that you commit another felony, that are easily double or triple the normal penalties for first time offenders.
At this point, you gotta work for it, work HARD for it, and for the rest of your life, have the Sword of Damocles hanging over your head until the day you assume room temperature.
Trust is given freely because you're born in the greatest nation on earth. Once broken, it can't be fully repaired, but can come close. It can never become whole again.
Good luck in your journey,
Angry Patriot
If the conviction was a state conviction, he can apply for a governors pardon with full restoration of rights. For the purposes of GCA prohibitions, "Conviction" is defined by the court having jurisdiction over the crime so a a state crime can be pardoned by the state. IF it was a federal conviction then the pres is the authority.
The BATF&E used to have a process to restore firearms rights only but that has been defunded. The code is still there and they could actually do it if they had the mandate and funding to.
The author of the letter has done his homework. BATFE (now DOJ) has un-funded the bodies that he needs.
The only other possible approach would be to have the conviction expunged or pardoned. If it didn't happen, you didn't lose your rights.
There is a possibility of that happening - ten years ago, clean record since, stable citizen, etc. Time is in your side - the longer you wait the better your arguement is. I am not certain what state you are in, but that may help the climate a bit too - at least with the mental state of those you have to deal with
Have the Robb check the site: http://peacesecurity.suite101.com/article.cfm/gun_ownership_by_convicted_felons. Might be helpful.
As a appeal is stale after ten years, he is likely left with:
1. seeking a pardon,
2. Post Conviction Relief Petition (sort of like a civil lawsuit against the state allegeding his civil rights were violated. Most common avenue is Ineffective Assistance of Counsel).
He needs to speak with an attorney who does this sort of work.
Shootin' Buddy
"Your story is EXACTLY why I think that gun rights should be restored upon serving one's time."
Here, here!
My thinking on it is this - if you've been punished sufficiently to be let out of jail, then you're back in the societal fold, and due all rights thereof.
If you can't be let back into society's fold, then you need to be in prison.
Not to mention that a (hardly) determined 'felon' will get a firearm regardless.
AngryPatriot,
If the offence is so heinous that one's civil liberties need to continue to be curtailed, than one should still be serving under sentance.
So, if you want to strip a person of civil liberties like voting, or teh Constitutionally enumerated right of keeping and bearing arms, you (the people, through your elected representatives) should have made the penalty for that offence longer.
If I cannot trust an adult citizen to exercise his rights and responsibilities, he should still be serving time -- either in custody, or on parole. Once he is done with that sentance, he should be restored to sovereignity automatically.
Think some crimes are so heinous that th person could NEVER be trusted again? Make the penalty a life sentance.
Any man that is to dangerous to be trusted with a gun is too dangerous to be trusted to walk the streets a free man.
If the offense is so heinous, then the offender should be locked up until he is no longer a danger to society. If not, then he should be restored his rights as a free man.
Fifthly, depending on your state's laws, take up black powder shooting.
As far as the feds are concerned, a cap and ball revolver ain't a gun. Many states agree.
Hey guys, I'm the fellow who sent Jay this e-mail. Thanks for your support and info. I will be consulting with a highly recommended 2nd Amendment lawyer next week, and will be submitting my pardon application to my Governor (who is a liberal, but he actually instituted the program that replaced a potentially lengthly prison term with a short stay in the big house followed by a ton of probation and treatment. I am a perfect example of this program's success) later this year. That was lot to put in parentheses, lol.
Angry Patriot: The 2nd Amendment is what we as Americans use to protect our right to life, if not liberty and happiness. I'm not asking to carry concealed, not asking for a Class 3 or and FFL, I just want to be able to protect my home and family, and turn the occasional prairie dog into a pretty pink cloud...
Geodkyt, I respectfully disagree. As I stated, everyone born in this country has the automatic trust of the country and its citizens. Once that trust is broken, it can NEVER be fully repaired. Period.
Now, as for saying *make it a life sentence*, we can make sentences as harsh as hell, but as long as we have Lib judges who are willing to let felons go due to a number of reasons, well short of the actual time served, then I for one do NOT think that the perp has paid his debt and can be trusted.
Sorry Anon, if this sounds real harsh and you're on the smelly end of my beliefs, but I stand by my convictions (no pun intended) and will say again, the trust that was freely given WITHOUT QUESTION must now be repaired, and it has to be made very difficult.
Again, best of luck in your journey...
Patriot
Here is the problem with our system. I am all for the removal of rights of convicted felons. However, the definition of felon has become very watered down.
I believe a felon should only be defined as a violent criminal. I don't believe felonies should be for anything else. That or we need a new term for predatorial crimes.
California law allows a felon, once compliance with probation/parole has been satisified, to move the court to reduce the conviction to a misdemeanor. If that happens, then you can move to quash and your record is clean. Not sure if a drug conviction is one that can be reduced. Might want to check your state's law and see if they have this process on its books.
AngryPatriot,
If "felony" meant what it traditionally DID mean, I might agree with you.
Originally, felony = capital offence. Misdemeanors were everything they DIDN'T hang you for.
Now you can ignorantly commit a felony by violating some obscure regulation.
But to say that someone who landed an undersized shellfish, or absentmindedly drove a car with an unloaded gun locked up in the trunk into the wrong parking lot, or made a stupid decision at 17 years old that didn't actually hurt anyone else has inexoriably "violated the trust of his fellow citizens" is a little much.
For one, I don't see the "violation" as meriting an AUTOMATIC lifetime annullemnt of your rights and civil liberties.
For two, we do not enjoy our rights as a matter of TRUST "of the people" -- your rights are NOT granted to you by any trust of people.
Any right dependant on the trust of your fellow citizens can be unilaterally stripped form you BY that collective. . . regardless of whether you have done anything wrong yourself. Just because they decide they do not trust you anymore.
POLITICIANS and GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS have to enjoy the trust of the people -- but not a person's exercise of his Constututional rights.
Here's a classic example of what having your rights dependant on some "trust of the people":
ANY minority oppressed by the majority.
Blacks were denied civil rights becuase they did not enjoy the trust of the white majority. Including the right to vote and the right to keep and bear arms.
Catholics in England were denied the right to hold public office and the right to bear arms, as they did not enjoy the trust of the people (i.e., Protestants).
The list goes on and on, including invoking Godwin's Law.
The next time you want basic civil liberties and enumerated rights to be ruled by the trust of the people, you follow the Brady Campaign's party line.
They would deny us the right to keep and bear arms becuase they do not trust us.
Now, imagine the Brady Campaign as a majority of the population. . . you still willing to claim that one must enjoy the trust of the people to enjoy your rights?
if someone's criminal conduct is so severe that they should lose their rights for life, then they need to be under sentance for life.
Don't like activist judges cutting their sentences short? Quit voting for politicians who confirm activist judges. Pass madatory sentanceing laws that state that, even if parole is granted, the life sentence is still in effect -- i.e., they are on parole for life. PASS A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT if you must. There are some malum in se ("wrong in itself") acts that SHOULD be punished with a loss of certain freedoms forever -- because the person has demonstrated they are DANGEROUS.
But do not expect me to respect an argument that a person who committed a malum prohibitum ("wrong becuase it is prohibited") act without mens rea ("guilty mind" -- i.e., "intent"), from which no actual harm (economic or otherwise) to another person resulted, has somehow lost his rights because of his horrible violation of the trust of the people.
I do not put place the retention of my rights on so frail a support as "trust".
"The law is the law"? *Gag!!*
Being a libertarian, I'm no blind respecter of "law" for law's sake.
I agree with the great Walter Williams when he said, "Immoral laws are not worthy of obedience".
This was not for a crime or violence or force, but for a drug law violation, a matter in which many (including me) would argue the government has no legal Constitutional jurisdiction. (Remember that concept?!)
And Hell - isn't EVERYTHING a felony now?!
That having been said, was the violation of State or Federal law?
If it's State, you need a pardon from the governor. Some States have other mechanisms such as a board of pardons, etc.
If Federal, the pardon must come from the president. The BATFE cannot legally help you due to a lack of funding to carry out this function.
Repeat after me: "No victim, no crime".
Hey all, it's me again, the felon in question. Figured I'd update you on what I have found. I talked with a lawyer, who basically said that while Colorado law reinstates my rights after ten years, the federal laws supersede state law. This means that while Colorado has no problem with me possessing firearms, it remains a federal crime to do so. While this is a problem, the lawyer said that if I apply for (and receive) a pardon from my governor, the felony is basically annulled and the feds will no longer have a say in the matter. I hadn't intended to apply for a pardon, as being felon hasn't really hindered me, but now I will be going for it. I will update Jay on progress or new information as I come across it. Thank you all for your support and advice, gunnies are a good group of people, one of the many reasons I want to rejoin the fraternity.
Hey, I have recently gone through the pardons process in the State of CT. It took me from 4/09 to 2/10to receive my full pardon.
You should have a board of pardons and parole in your state. I would either go online and download an app for your hearing request for a pardon ( Not an easy process ) or visit an office by you. You will have to jump through hoops but to restore your rights and effectively erase your past mistakes ( youthful indescretions, I say ) it would be worth it.
With that being said do not expect to get your permit to carry trhat easily. I recently applied with my local PD to get my temp state permit. Somehow they were aware that I went for the pardons appeal and wish to question me before deciding whether to grant me a temp permit or not. Keep in mind my record is "TOTALLY " erased. I can honestly and truly state I have never bee nconvicted of a crime.. This does not seem to mattre to local authoritis though. I have been out of trouble for over a decade now, married 12 years with 4 children. I have lived a productive and lawful life for quite some time now. I meet with the Chief of police Friday 3/26 and will then know what his decision is. I have consulted a lawyer to figure out if this is necessaryu that I need to divulge any past history as it has been pardoned. I expect that the chief may grant me my permiot asa I have/will be up front and honest about my past mistakes. However, being somewhat of a pessimist I am prepared for a denial and having to go through the appeals process. This in itself could take an extra 9-10 months just to get a hearing. Whioh I plan to seek the help of an attorney either belonging to the NRA or one that works with the organization.
Good luck with your pardon search,stay positive it can be done. Hope this helped..
Angry Patriot, your view is respectful, but very closed minded. I would agree if it were restricted to violent crimes.
People make mistakes. A person writes a few too many bad checks and gets convicted of a felony for check fraud. Suggesting that this person had lost the trust of society completely and should lose all civil liberties because of it?
Let's get one thing straight. There are crimes that I think once crossed, allot of hard work should be in place before they can gain some rights back. Some crimes, those losses of rights should be permanent.
But a man who committed a white collar crime, if any sort, I think it's unrealistic to think they are going to be a menace if they own a gun.
Truth is, if some one who wants to commit a crime with a gun is a felon, they are going to find a way to get that gun. Criminals rarely ever commit a crime with a gun registered to their own name. It's almost unheard of today.
When the framers wrote or Constitution, they had criminals amongst them even then, is it even a wonder why it took almost a hundred years later to amend it to block criminals?
I understand some criminals are pushed back or of prison with no rehabilitation, but again some crimes should never have been listed as a felony imo.
I was arrested with steroids and plead guilty to possession with intent to distribute. First and only time getting into trouble ever. This was over ten years ago and it has stopped me from getting jobs. I spent ten weeks in jail for this, mostly because they wanted me to set somebody up who was selling oxy cotton who grew up in my neighborhood. I hadn't seen this guy in three years never mind buy drugs off him that I had never had anything to do with ever.
I paid my debt to whoever it was owed for having steroids in my home, but it still follows me to this day.
Even violent "felonies" should be case by case. Sometimes, people are convicted of the felony because others lied. I know a man (17 yrs old) who got a felony for assault and battery because he defended himself against a larger, older guy who was connected to money and this young man was dirt poor. Justice is NOT always served here on earth. This now older man cannot own a gun because of the violent nature of the felony (he kicked the crud out of the older bigger guy sending him to the hospital) so they called it assault and batter with a deadly weapon (his foot)... and had no prior criminal issues. 33 yrs. , went to college, became a professional, raised a family...etc, etc.. The law is tailor made for those with money.
Did you ever receive a pardon?
Nope, moved to Phoenix and my pardon in CO doesn't do anything for me here. I recently decided to apply for it just on principle, later this year...
Same exact thing happened to me! except it was over a girl who I started talking to.
I didn't know she had a boyfriend and when he saw me talking to her, he tried to confront me. I didn't even know she had a boyfriend until he punched me first.
I was 20 years old and I'm now 41.
raised four children working every day of my life married for 20 years and I'm federally banned from owning a gun in New Hampshire.
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