I caught the tail end of an interesting back-and-forth this morning on a local radio station. The female co-host was complaining about one of the support staff's comments to a female visitor ("smokin' hot" was the term I believe). Her view was that not only was his comment inappropriate, but that any compliment from a stranger would also be inappropriate. "Creepy" was the term that was used. The male co-host of the show was incredulous that any sort of compliment would be taken as something creepy; call-ins from female listeners seemed to break about 50:50.
There were several interesting sidelines to those that disagreed it would be creepy. Nearly all the female listeners agreed that the delivery played an important role in how the line would be delivered - someone getting in their personal space and leering would obviously be creepy; a passing comment from an appreciative onlooker, made in the spirit of giving a compliment, would not. Several callers made mention of the attractiveness of the man making the comment - a good looking man's comment would be appreciated, but ugly guys should keep their mouths shut. It was an interesting glimpse into the mindset of those that would - or would not - be offended, and only cemented my own personal decision to keep my damn mouth shut.
So what's the opinion? Is an unsolicited compliment from a stranger creepy? Isn't an unsolicited comment from someone you know - particularly a co-worker - just asking for trouble in today's hyperlitigious society? Perhaps that's where "creepy" comes in - in our overly sensitive society, *any* look/compliment/attention from a man to a woman could be misread as something sinister or harassing. Any man willing to open himself up to claims of harassment or leering might well be in the "creepy" category. It's somewhat offensive that the assumption is automatically that the man wants or expects something - like we can't possibly just appreciate beauty for beauty's sake.
Then again, a quick look at the news reveals that there's plenty of reasons women mistrust men in general...
That is all.
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I'd have to say context has much to do with it, though my experience breaks far more to the creepy side. Awkward dude hitting on me on campus? Flattering. Seemingly-inebriated fellow hanging out the window of his buddy's pickup truck to shout that I'm "hot"? Creepy. (An obvious example, perhaps, but you'd be surprised how often I had to deal with that once I hit puberty.)
It is a no-win situation for guys, though, because the only difference between creepy and flattering in most situations really is just how it's received.
I was going to leave a comment, but couldn't think of a way to put it that would be any less boorish than the women saying that the creepiness of the comment was based on how the person making the comment looked.
Since I ain't exactly tall or good looking, I've learned to resist any impulse to give a compliment...
Isn't an unsolicited comment from someone you know - particularly a co-worker - just asking for trouble in today's hyperlitigious society?
Unfortunately yes. The most I'll say to my more attractive female co-workers is "you look nice today."
I agree with Sabra that context is everything (not to mention how you say it)
You really have to tread lightly, particularly if you're a guy. Some folks just have a stick up their ass.
I think word choice is extremely important, obviously. And I think it's safer for everyone to keep their mouths shut nowadays, unfortunately. You never now how a compliment is going to be received. Better safe than sorry.
I think that whether you know the person has a lot to do with it.
Guy whose name I know saying he likes my skirt = Fine
Guy on my floor whom I've never met saying he likes my skirt = Weird
The only exception to the rule? Shoes. (Duh.) Anyone can tell me my shoes are awesome. 'Cause they are!
Best illustration for this -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBVuAGFcGKY
"Then again, a quick look at the news reveals that there's plenty of reasons women mistrust men in general..."
And you've just played into the problem, Jay.
It is news because it is RARE. To treat all men with mistrust because of the deeds of a few is playing into the man hating stereotype.
I think you've just come up with the next VC topic. :D
"Guy on my floor whom I've never met saying he likes my skirt = Weird"
Guy who thinks your boots are bitchen! = Weer'd ; ]
As for the topic at hand, being offended is an unpredictable thing, and the PC people seem to think "there ought to be a law".
Bah, I just call 'em how I see 'em! : ]
...yet another reason why I am happy to be away from polite society.
Having said that, I've noticed that as I age and dress better, I've been able to 'get away with' complementing women for the most part, but my social circle is narrowing, too. I'm pretty sure that the women in my life know that I'm not hitting on them when I say that they look nice... except for my wife, whom I'm most certainly hitting on when I say such things.
Ohhh.. let me see if I understand now .. By Alans example then if I am not mistaken, all our elected representatives are basically good , honest , hardworking folk who keep our interests foremost in mind . All the stories of graft , corruption, pork, and back room deals make the news because they are so rare .
Point: FarmDad.
HEY! That's not fair FD. Congress is pure concentrated evil. Not the same at all.
You made a good point, a handsome guy saying it, compared to a "sleazy" looking guy is completely different. EVEN if said int he same exact context... ;O)
That last time I used the term "smokin hot" a barbecue was involved.
In my opinion, it's today's vernacular that leads to the "creepy" word. A great deal of women follow the trend of how others are speaking and expressing themselves...becoming overdramatic and allowing things to be "scary" or "awkward" or anything else that the phrases actually don't fit. It is sickening. Most women who receive appropriate compliments don't allow themselves to feel good about it, and those that do are considered loose.
Sabra said it's a no-win situation for men, which is true for the most part, but it can quickly become a losing situation for women because men are going to stop complimenting them if all we are to become is perverted for doing so.
Ah, the world of gender equality. Where men have to treat women differently because of their gender. Wait... what?
"smokin hot" isn't a compliment, it's a come-on.
"You look beautiful today." is a a compliment. There's no way to take that as anything other than a compliment unless you've been stalking the woman or she's the kind of feminazi bitch that looks at everything coming from a male as an invitation to be raped.
I'm with Bill. There are ways to say things, and the environment in which they are said as well as how well you know the party making the statement must be considered as part of the context.
Though I've never actually been told I look smokin hot by someone I didn't know pretty well, so maybe I can't give an informed opinion.
I do think that we are too oversensitized in today's environment to the point where actual sexual harassment is no longer distinguishable from either good natured compliment (no matter how ham-handed or ill-stated) or inappropriate come on. One of these things is NOT like the other in any case, though there are those who like to make us think they are all the same thing. And that's a shame. I like being complimented, and I do feel that the world we live in is sadly moving us away from that every day courtesy.
You really have to tread lightly, particularly if you're a guy. Some folks just have a stick up their ass.
At my first job--this was back in 1997--my sole male coworker got in trouble for "sexual harassment." He'd complimented a female coworker and someone who overheard it got offended.
The young man had never been anything but unfailingly polite to all the women in the office, but one gal with a stick up her ass got him in hot water (I think he actually was fired, but I don't remember). Even though the woman he said it to wasn't offended, it was still considered sexual harassment.
I just keep my mouth shut... :-)
I'm with NFO, I keep my mouth shut. Thing is, the female co-workers in my career have displayed MUCH saltier language than the males. Oh, sure, the guys will say stuff behind the backs of the females, the kind of things that would get them fired on the spot if it was overheard, but the females will say things OUT LOUD & in front of everyone, things that I would never say in front of women. Of course, they know they can say it because guys will never, ever, think any kind of compliment is creepy.
Heck, we take it when we can get it.
Why is this just an issue of MEN complimenting WOMEN? I have heard women make creepier comments (or compliments) than most men I have heard. There is a difference between a compliment "you look very nice today" and a come on " Hey good looking where you been all my life".
No one in our society today knows how to give or receive a compliment.
I actually have told another woman she was smoking hot before, or on fire. My comments have always been met with appreciation or delight, generally. Then again, I said something playful in response to a comment from a supervisor at work recently and she reacted with revulsion. I think it's natural we would notice the hotness of others, and like the cartoon someone posted recently, it's a bit psychotic for women to get breast implants and then complain about men staring at their tits. Call me weird for saying so. Psycho plays into the equation rather more than one would prefer, actually in the case of a lady who doth protest too much[or a man].
It's good to remember that a closed mouth gathers no feet.
Its an age gap thing IMO. 20 something male says something complimentary to 20 something female, probably will be fine. 50 something male says something complimentary to 20 something female, probably not.
Myself as a 26 year old male, I tell my coworker (23) she looks great all the time; yesterday she approved of the shirt / tie combo I had on and said it was hot. (Needless to say I filed that info right away!) I suppose you have to know your audience. I would NEVER say anything to a woman, even my own age, in the workplace without getting to know her first.
This all I have to say about those that think a compliment is creepy.
"Smokin' hot" = compliment, albeit kind of junior high
"You look nice today" = compliment, albeit weak.
You look beautiful today" = compliment but untrustworthy as it's over the top.
"Nice tits" = creepy
Just my opinion. Everyone's too damn sensitive these days. I blame the Politically Correctness Nazis.
I admit, I've never been complimented by a guy my age or by a random stranger. Ever. So admittedly, I would view such comments with a combination of suspicion and appreciation - just how much of the two would be in my response would depend on the diction and inflection of said comment, as well as whether the person is someone I know or not.
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