How to get your C&R license.
It's actually pretty darn simple:
- Step 1: Go here.
- Step 2: Request F 7CR (5310.16) - Application for License (Collector of Curios and Relics) Under 18 U.S.C. Chapter 44, Firearms
- Step 3: Receive form, fill out, send back with payment.
- Step 4: Submit a copy (minus payment/payment info) to your local Chief of Police
- Step 5: Wait for C&R license to show up.
Things to do once you have your C&R.
First thing you'll want to do is to make a couple dozen copies of your C&R. DO NOT SIGN THE ORIGINAL. EVER. In fact, sign one copy (blue ink) and scan with the highest resolution scanner you can find, and then DO NOT SIGN any more copies. Scan another unsigned copy and save for future use. File away several unsigned copies, keep a copy or two in every gun case you have, heck, I even have a copy in my truck's console - just in case...
Now get a good Bound Book to record all of your acquisitions and dispositions - this one from Brownells is what I use. Anything that you purchase that is C&R eligible (either over 50 years old or on the C&R list) regardless of whether you use your C&R license to acquire the firearm, and must be recorded.
The next thing to do IMHO is to send a signed copy of your 03FFL to as many online retailers as you can think of:
MidwayUSA
Brownells
SOG
J&G Sales
AIMSurplus
Century
SAMCO
Both MidwayUSA and Brownells are kind enough to extend their dealer pricing to C&R holders. On more than one occasion, the discount on even a single item paid for the C&R license fee... Be sure to send a short letter introducing yourself as a C&R holder and include any other relevant information like shipping addresses, copies of state permits needed, etc.
Some tips on record-keeping.
Any firearm that is C&R eligible that you acquire or relinquish while you are the holder of an 03FFL must be recorded accordingly. Even if you did not use your C&R license to acquire said firearm, you still must record it in your bound book. If you own C&R eligible firearms before you get your license, they do not need to be recorded in your book unless you relieve yourself of these arms while holding the C&R license. IOW, the Mannlicher-Carcano I inherited from my grandfather is not currently recorded. If I decided tomorrow that I wanted to give it to my dad, I would have to record it as a disposition even though I owned it before the C&R license.
It is incumbent on you as an 03FFL to make sure that you properly record all C&R eligible firearms. There are many websites devoted to discerning the age of a given firearm via the serial number, but remember that these are not definitive nor legally binding - it's up to you. Erring on the side of caution would be recommended here - better to record the acquisition of a gun you think is only 49 years old based on an internet search than to find out the website was off by a year during an audit. The ATF gives the required format for recording transactions here - it's about halfway down the page, as shown here:
Firearms Acquisition and Disposition Record
| Description of firearm | Receipt | Disposition | |||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Manufacturer and/or Importer | Model | Serial No. | Type | Caliber or gauge | Date | Name and address or name and license No. | Date | Name | Address or license No. if licensee, or Form 4473 Serial No. if Forms 4473 filed numerically |
As always, I am not a lawyer, this is not to be considered legal advice, nothing is legally binding, etc. There's a lot of good things that come with having a C&R license, especially in the Volksrepublik of MA, and the discounts alone are worth the process IMHO. For me, the experience of having a semi-automatic handgun not on the Approved Firearms Roster {spit} delivered right to my door with the Attorney General being powerless to stop the transaction was reason enough for me to get the C&R license.
Hello, my name is Jay G., and I'm a cruffler.
That is all.
17 comments:
And God Bless America, because I can order an M1 Garand online, and have it show up at my house just in time for me to get home from this hellhole and record it in my boundbook.
I don't know, I am not sure if I want to get that license. You are handing the keys to your house to the ATF, and they would never abuse that, right?
Thank you, Jay. Just ordered a set.
libertyman: Don't care. Government already has a dossier on me now. It's not like they don't already know I own guns. I'm not concerned.
When you start going for Form 4 stuff, then bend over and lube up.
Libertyman,
C&R FFLs are not audited to the same level as commercial FFLs. I believe they will let you take your guns and books to their office for your audit, if one ever occurs.
Canadian,
An individual with items on form 1 or 4 does not give up ANY privacy rights. No audits, inspections, etc. They just have your name and mailing address on the form, and you don't even need to use a human name or physical address.
Only FFLs get audited, not individuals.
In rare cases, ATF will inquire about a particular gun (usually when using info from the gun to gain info for a criminal prosecution). And in every case I am aware of the prosecution was entirely valid and passes my BS test. No different than if the DMV wanted to check the VIN on my car.
Libertyman,
I have a couple of friends who are C&R holders and got audited by the ATF. Both report that the agents were very professional and friendly, and very accommodating as to the time and place of the meeting (one guy was told by the agent that the ATF typically conducts the audit at the residence out of convenience for the C&R holder).
Let's face it: The ATF can audit anyone at any time - ask SayUncle about the visit he received...
"There's an awful lot of good things you can do with a C&R license, and the process isn't terribly difficult or expensive, so there's really no reason not to get a C&R."
I can see that being true someplace like MA, but living in a free state like I do, I just don't see the benefits outweighing the the negatives. I'd have to open up my home to the ATF at their whim, keep up with strictly and arbitrarily enforced paperwork requirements at the risk of ruinous fines or jail time for a mere typo, and pay an annual(?) fee (how much is that, anyway?).
In exchange, I get to have firearms delivered directly to my door, and a discount from a couple of distributors. What else?
I can't afford to buy guns frequently enough for home delivery to be useful - I'd have to make arrangements to be home when the delivery comes in. It's much more convenient, even with the extra cost, to pay my dealer's the transfer fees and have it shipped there. Then I get a phone call when it comes in and I can just drop by after work to pick it up.
Got far too many toys that would fit that profile already. Don't relish the idea of trying to convince a GS-9 batfeag that yes, I bought that Enfield before I got my C&R, but that one I got after.
Thanks for the info Jay!
Jake/Riposte: It's $30 for three years, and anyone who spends a fair chunk with Midway or Brownell's will make that back up in a year.
Jay: Fantastic timing. I'm in the midst of arranging a deal for a C&R Ithaca 37 from out in your neck of the woods. :)
I hate to say it, but I'm with Jake. I don't want anything to do with ATF if I can avoid it.
ZerCool: Not nearly as bad as I expected, then (I was guessing ~$100/yr). Money-wise, that would be worth it. Liability-wise, well, avoiding ATF as much as possible still outweighs the benefits I would get.
But, like I said, for guys like Jay that live in Taxachusettstan, it could be worth the hassle.
BTW, Jay: There's still plenty of room in Virginia for you! Bring Weer'd with you too! MUCH better gun laws, and NO "approved firearms roster" {spit!}.
First: Does Brownell's still give the discount? I let my C&R on file with them lapse for a while, and then wasn't able to find anything on their website about the C&R discount.
Second, and more important: I just recently helped a friend apply for his C&R. When he requested the application from ATF they "accidentally" included fingerprint cards, implying that he needed to submit prints. Also, they redid the forms since I got mine, and there are some really confusing parts. There was a part about submitting your hunting license info, and if you don't have a hunting license you most likely will not get your C&R. WTF does hunting have to do with it? Well, a not so quick call to ATF (made harder by the fact that the phone number ATF has listed on their website to call about these things was wrong, and belongs to a biz that says he gets 50 calls a day for ATF and could ya PLEASE ask them to fix it?) and it turns out the hunting part only applies to non-US citizens, and the fingerprint cards were a mistake, ignore them. As for correcting the website, my friend got caught in an endless loop of "not my job, I'll transfer you to someone else" until he finally hung up.
Oh, and as far as the discount at Midway. It only applies to certain items (usually stuff a shop might sell, rather then consume) and the the minimum order without a small order surcharge is like $40 instead of the $10-20 a regular person pays. Still, the discount on some items is more the worth it. I've seen 30-40% off on some items over their normal price.
Odd, blogger seems to have ate this post so I'm resubmitting:
First: Does Brownell's still give the discount? I let my C&R on file with them lapse for a while, and then wasn't able to find anything on their website about the C&R discount.
Second, and more important: I just recently helped a friend apply for his C&R. When he requested the application from ATF they "accidentally" included fingerprint cards, implying that he needed to submit prints. Also, they redid the forms since I got mine, and there are some really confusing parts. There was a part about submitting your hunting license info, and if you don't have a hunting license you most likely will not get your C&R. WTF does hunting have to do with it? Well, a not so quick call to ATF (made harder by the fact that the phone number ATF has listed on their website to call about these things was wrong, and belongs to a biz that says he gets 50 calls a day for ATF and could ya PLEASE ask them to fix it?) and it turns out the hunting part only applies to non-US citizens, and the fingerprint cards were a mistake, ignore them. As for correcting the website, my friend got caught in an endless loop of "not my job, I'll transfer you to someone else" until he finally hung up.
OK, posted this 2x already, and I know I did but blogger keeps eating it! I'm afraid eventually it's gonna spit them all back out again! Here we go:
First: Does Brownell's still give the discount? I let my C&R on file with them lapse for a while, and then wasn't able to find anything on their website about the C&R discount.
Second, and more important: I just recently helped a friend apply for his C&R. When he requested the application from ATF they "accidentally" included fingerprint cards, implying that he needed to submit prints. Also, they redid the forms since I got mine, and there are some really confusing parts. There was a part about submitting your hunting license info, and if you don't have a hunting license you most likely will not get your C&R. WTF does hunting have to do with it? Well, a not so quick call to ATF (made harder by the fact that the phone number ATF has listed on their website to call about these things was wrong, and belongs to a biz that says he gets 50 calls a day for ATF and could ya PLEASE ask them to fix it?) and it turns out the hunting part only applies to non-US citizens, and the fingerprint cards were a mistake, ignore them. As for correcting the website, my friend got caught in an endless loop of "not my job, I'll transfer you to someone else" until he finally hung up.
Guys,
NRA fought this one and won. C&R abuses by ATF were rampant and were a major reason the 1986 FOPA was enacted (as opposed to the extremely questionable MG freeze that was tacked on to the FOPA without ANY recorded votes) C&R FFLs DO NOT go through anything like a dealer or manufacturer FFL does.
IF ATFE even bothers to insist on a compliance inspection (which they may ONLY do to a C&R FFL once a year), you can choose to meet the agents at the ATF office with just your bound book.
They CANNOT just walk up to your house and demand that you allow them to do an "administrative audit", like they can a dealer FFL.
Couple of things:
1. You only log in items that you acquire from your license. If you buy a gun that is a C&R and go through the 4473 etc, it is yours, not done under the license.
2. Most people miss this: If you acquire a gun unfer the C&R you MUST fill out and send in a FA10.
See: http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/4712-Reporting-Sales-Purchases-Acquisitions-for-MA-FA-10-s
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