Thursday, April 8, 2010

Conundrum...

I'm still dithering over my Buy A Gun Day purchase. I'd mentioned wanting a new .22LR semi-automatic pistol for new shooters, as my trusty S&W 422 is a little on the finicky side; there have been a handful of "ooh, that would be nice to have" guns I've come across in the past couple of months; there's a couple holes left in the armory (long distance rifles come to mind); basically, I'm just not sure what I want to get right now.

Y'see, living in the Volksrepublik, it pains me greatly to just walk into a gun store and buy a new gun (handgun) off the shelf. There's no sport in that. I'd much rather stake out the perfect acquisition, then put out WTB requests, scour gun shop websites, and hit the local online forums looking for private sales. It's a good way to find "off list" firearms of interest (like my P3AT) or stumbling across a killer deal (like the S&W Model 19). Kinda the whole "thrill of the chase" thing, with the added bonus of honing my haggling skills when I do find something of interest.

So, as you might imagine, buying a new gun off the shelf at a gun store holds about as much appeal to me as watching a Rosie O'Donnell porno.

[pause to let that image percolate. You're welcome]

Looking back, I can only remember a handful of guns that I've ever bought new - the Snubbie from Hell™ being one of them - most of my firearms are used, and well-worn and loved at that. I'd wager I'm hardly the third, fourth, or even fifth owner on some of the guns in the G. armory at this point; I think if I were to research my guns I'd find the majority are older than I am; I'd wager a significant number are older than my dad (considering that a large percentage of my armory came from my grandfather that's not a wild stretch, actually).

I don't see much point in buying a new gun. A properly constructed firearm should last centuries; even modern firearms with polymer frames and MIM parts should be robust enough to hand down to one's grandchildren after a lifetime of hard labor. There's no shame in owning a Lorcin, Bryco, Jennings, or Cobra - everyone needs at least one gun that makes them appreciate SigSauers, Smith & Wessons, and Colts - but that's not what I'm looking for now.


I told you all that so I can ask your opinion on this:

It looks like I'm going to have to bite the bullet (ha! gun pun!) and actually buy a new gun for BAG Day. What's troubling me is not that I'm buying a new gun, but that if I am actually going to break down and buy a new gun, which one to get? I've got it narrowed down to two firearms, both rimfires:

1. Ruger Mark III - I can't decide between the Target, Competition, or Hunter models. A good point was made about the fiber optic sight of the Hunter not being ideal for precision target work, and there's a fair bit to that - not that my shooting would be able to discern the difference, mind you; however that fluted stainless barrel is just drop-dead sexy. The blued, bull-barreled Target is the least expensive of the group (MSRP $430, on shelves for low $300s); the Hunter or Competition are within a few dollars of each other ($638 vs. $625 MSRP; I've seen the Hunter in a local gun store for $480).

2. Smith & Wesson M&P15-22. What can I say? I got bit by the AR bug pretty hard. My Bushmaster covers the centerfire needs pretty well, but boy would it be nice to have a dedicated .22LR for plinking, training, and trying out accessories before putting them on the Bushmaster. Heck, this could even be the rifle I bring to an Appleseed shoot... It would be nice to have a magazine-fed .22LR semi-automatic rifle in the armory (that doesn't take long-discontinued mags); having one that's a trainer for a centerfire rifle is a definite selling point. The hardest part about getting an M&P15-22 would be keeping myself from putting so much crap on it that I can't lift it...


So those are the two finalists. A lot will depend on what's actually in the shop when I walk through the door - I know they've been having a hard time keeping the M&P15-22 on the shelves, so if I happen to walk in and one's there I might snap it up just because. I might also wind up with a Ruger pistol because that's all that's available. Then again, I might get a 22/45 and a 10/22 for the same money... Heh.

Which of the two would you choose?

That is all.

19 comments:

Anonymous said...

I've got a SW 15-22 setup to match my .223 AR, with the same Magpul goodies (grip and rail panels). It's a great training tool, but the 10-round magazines are annoying. I may be selling it to fund my own BAG day purchase,

Jay G said...

They do make 25 round magazines for the M&P15-22, don't they? That's what I'd get if I lived in America...

(grumbles)

Anonymous said...

The real reason the 10 rounders are annoying are that they are the 25 rounders, with rivets through them. A constant reminder, and a bit difficult to load.

But it's great fun to shoot, accurate, and you get to practice mag changes!

elmo iscariot said...

For what it's worth, I love, love, love my fiancee's MkIII Hunter. It's far more accurate than I am (even with the FO sights), eats any jacketed or round-nosed lead ammo without a complaint, and all that weight out front makes it ridiculously easy to keep on target while firing. Plus, it's pretty enough to give it some real pride of ownership even though it's so new. It's the first gun I give to friends when they shoot for the first time, and every one of them has fallen in love with it. I shoot it, easily, ten times more often than any of our other guns.

DJ said...

Hey Jay,

I'd recommend the S&W M&P-22, while acknowledging a few restrictions: it probably won't eat the cheaper bulk-pack plinking ammo (I feed mine CCI Mini-Mags with excellent results in both accuracy and function), and if you feed it the wrong stuff, it MAY blow case heads (A buddy bought one and blew a case head TWICE with the Winchester ammo on the "recommended" list that came with the gun -- two trips back to the factory). Don't worry about power-lifting the gun after accessories are added; it's light as a feather to begin with, and your wallet will probably give-out long before your arms. If I had bought (rather than dug out of the accessories drawer) everything on my S&W M&P-22, I would have doubled what I paid for the basic weapon. Pics:

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/86/sw22ar14inwebb.jpg

http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/6687/sw22ar14inweb.jpg

I'd go the "22/45 and 10/22" route as the second choice, over a new MK-III. The 10/22 can be dressed-up in many different ways, and in my limited experience the 22/45 MK-IIs are far more reliable than any of the MK-IIIs I've seen.

Veeshir said...

I'd go for the M&P precisely because you can accessorize it.
I'm not a big fan of over accessoried weapons, but that M&P begs for it.

I actually ordered a new gun for Bag Day but it's still not in, I'm starting to despair. It's an Uberti and I gather it's lost somewhere in the Pyrenees.
I love rifle/pistol combos and I need a .45 LC rifle.

I'm embarrassed my cowboy caliber is the one place I don't have a rifle/pistol combo since my reading of Zane Grey is why I started liking the combo thing in the first place.

Wally said...

The rugers should run any ammo. I have the Mk2s in Target, Comp, and Govt' Target.... All are sweet shooters and ferociously accurate with decent ammo. The slab side barrel does have a slightly different feel to it when raised in a one-handed grip. Fondle one if you get the opportunity.

Havent experienced the M&P, but I think your first decision should be if you want a rifle or pistol.

zeeke42 said...

Both excellent choices. I own a Mk3 and had an M&P-15-22 in my hands that I very nearly bought. I was at S&W for the IDPA indoor nationals, and competitors got 40% off list in the retail store. I'm kinda kicking myself, but I really didn't have the cash, even at that low price. Buy both eventually :)

Mopar said...

Get the 22/45 Target AND a 10/22. Then when you have a few more pennies saved up get the M1 carbine stock for it along with the military style sights. Then you have a target pistol that will eat just about any ammo (so will the rifle)and a cool looking appleseed rifle. And to top it off, both guns can be modified out the wazzoo when you get bored with them.

zeeke42 said...

I like the regular mk3 much better than the 22/45. The 22/45 doesn't balance right due to the light weight grip. Also, being able to change the grips makes the mk3 a better target gun.

My mk3 eats every load I throw at it. (mostly 550 federal bulk for plinking and aguila svse for target)

Michael in CT said...

I'd recommend a Ruger MKII (even used) over the MKIII, it doesn't have the magazine safety affecting the trigger and there are LOTS of accesories out there for the MKII platform. As for the rifle, why don't you get the .22 conversion kit for your AR and then you can spend more money on ammo or have some extra money in the buy a gun fund.

Mopar said...

Zeeke: The new 22/45 lets you use 1911 replacement grips and is only a little more money then the non replaceable grip model: http://ruger.com/products/2245ReplaceablePanels/index.html

Michael: The mag disconnect on the MkIII can be removed for about $5. Pretty much anything that fits a MkII will fit a MkIII.

zeeke42 said...

is the new 22/45 available in MA? My money is on no.

I second the easy mag disco removal on the 3. It's way easier than moving the mag release on the 2.

Buddy said...

My $.02 = Get the S&W 15-22. IMHO, Ruger ruined the MkII with the MkIII... I had an opportunity to disassemble and clean one shortly after they came to market. You have to follow the manual EXACTLY as written to accomplish said task. And it was NOT intuitive! Now, I grant you, the MkII was not the easiest thing to take apart and reassemble, the MKIII is........ well, I have been on the lookout for a used MKII!

Ambulance Driver said...

1. As long as the fiber optic sight on the Mark III doesn't totally obscure the berm, you should be able to shoot to your customary degree of accuracy. [evil grin]

2. I love the S&W 15-.22 I bought for KatyBeth. It's a very nice little rifle.

Had some feeding and ejecting issues a couple of days ago with it, all with bulk Winchester plated ammo. A couple of the cases ruptured, and a good many failed to eject.

Of course, the gun being dirty probably had a lot to do with the ejection issues, but it's back to CCI Mini Mags for me.

aaronspuler said...

I have a Ruger MkIII -- just the standard one, no bull barrel, yes it kinda does look like the Nazi Luger's from WW2 -- and love the hell out of that gun. Haven't had an opportunity to play with a M&P15-22 so I can't comment on that one much. I will say that with the large magazine, it will make prone shooting difficult at Appleseed. I recently picked up a Marlin 60 for use at Appleseed. Got the tech sights and a USGI sling for it too.

EmmaPeel said...

Is a .22lr conversion kit allowed in MA? That'd be my choice. Brownells has one for a good price that I lurve! Who can't love shooting through a 500 round brick as fast as you can load 'em? If it's not allowed, the Ruger. The 15-22 is pricey.

weaponoffishdestruction@gmail.com said...

I'd recommend the Ruger SR22 for a trainer (over the MP15-22) although you may want to check out what previous owners of the MP15-22 are saying after they bought theirs. It kinda sounds like the buyers-remorse that you often hear about? As for my BAG purchase, it will surely be the Keltec, PMR-30.

Good luck,

zeeke42 said...

@Bobby: Why? What's the point of a 'trainer' with different controls? At that point, any 22 is just as good.